[Lucie]

I never got why people were so hung up about companies having certain 'quotas' that they needed to fill. Sometimes it can be the only way to change things!

You are going for a job. You're in a waiting room with someone from an ethnic minority. You get chatting, and it's clear (s)he is underqualified for the job, and you're going to get the post easily. Two weeks later, you find that the other person got it because the company had to fill the quota.

Bad for you cos at the end of the day, you wasted your time applying and going for the interview, which was reduced to a formality because as soon as the other person's CV hit the desk, the job was theirs. And it's bad for the company because they're not getting the best person for the job.

Then, when that person is in the job. They may be very good, but everyone knows thay were only in the job because of the colour of their skin, causing resentment. If YOU are trying to move within the organisation, you and your friends will feel resentment which will spread. In the end, you could end up CREATING racism problems because everyone in the office will feel anti-whatever that person is.

I'm in favour of personnel depts. removing all ethnic, age, name and disability information from CVs, and people hired purely on merit. Positive discrimination can be as detrimental as negative.

Oddly enough, a friend of mine in Botswana says that in his large organisation they resent white people because having a white person on-staff is quite a status symbol, so they're hired with better money and perks. It's causing big rifts in that organisation..

So you see, +ve discrimination can cause big problems unless carefully controlled.

But that's a very extreme case! I don't think ethnic minorities should be employed if they're rubbish or anything

In certain companies they look at the ratio of ethnic groups and then use this to guide them in their recruitment decisions. If there are 50/50 white/ minority people in an area, it's most likely that a similar proportion of people from each group have similar potential/ intelligence. In a lot of areas white people have benefitted from a higher quality of education and come from richer homes so of course they may superficially seem better suited for certain jobs. But then if they are the only ones who are ever recruited, then you're only deepening the institutional racism that is already so embossed in our society! Ethnic minority groups will never be given a chance, it'll be a vicious cycle!

Like I said I don't think people should be employed just because they're not white, just that at the moment race should be considered just so in the long term, maybe it won't have to be an issue

[Lucie]

But sometimes the reason why 'positive discrimination' is used in the first place is to get more minority groups into certain work areas! If people aren't given a chance, things will never change! I never got why people were so hung up about companies having certain 'quotas' that they needed to fill. Sometimes it can be the only way to change things!

And by the way the advert is VERY offensive :O!

VERY VERY good post Lucie. I love you by the way.

Hehe you lil' charmer sidlarar . Hope everything's ok with you ! (By the way, don't you think this thread would be perfect if Oliver made an appearance?!)

[Furious]

Just by looking at the ratio of ethnic groups in companies is racist. If a white male is better suited to the job than an asian gay male, then surely he should get the job and vice verca. If it came down to it, who would you want defending your country when the civil unrest from the assylum seekers and extremists happens?

[Lucie]

Just by looking at the ratio of ethnic groups in companies is racist. If a white male is better suited to the job than an asian gay male, then surely he should get the job and vice verca. If it came down to it, who would you want defending your country when the civil unrest from the assylum seekers and extremists happens?

You twat

[fish heads]

Just by looking at the ratio of ethnic groups in companies is racist. If a white male is better suited to the job than an asian gay male, then surely he should get the job and vice verca. If it came down to it, who would you want defending your country when the civil unrest from the assylum seekers and extremists happens?

Whoever was the best for the job, you stupid idiot.

[Furious]

Whoever was the best for the job, you stupid idiot.

My point exactly... So why should someone be given the job because of the colour of his skin?

As for calling me a stupid idiot? You seem to be taking it to heart old chap, theres no need to get so uptight and sling personal abuse at someone for trying to get their point across.

[Furious]

You twat

Right back at ya. Now keep your legs crossed before you say something silly.

[fish heads]

Whoever was the best for the job, you stupid idiot.

My point exactly... So why should someone be given the job because of the colour of his skin?

As for calling me a stupid idiot? You seem to be taking it to heart old chap, theres no need to get so uptight and sling personal abuse at someone for trying to get their point across.

So why say

If it came down to it, who would you want defending your country when the civil unrest from the assylum seekers and extremists happens?

Which has no bearing on your argument and infact undermines your point as it implies (weather you intended it to or not) that the white man would be better than the gay asian at defending the country...

[Lucie]

You twat

Right back at ya. Now keep your legs crossed before you say something silly.

So now you're resulting to sexist insults? because in my book, that's just as bad as racism. You are an insult to your country. people like you make me feel sick, you make me ashamed to be British. It's exactly that kind of attitude that is responsible the continuation of racist discrimination. Idiot.

[Furious]

You twat

Right back at ya. Now keep your legs crossed before you say something silly.

So now you're resulting to sexist insults? because in my book, that's just as bad as racism. You are an insult to your country. people like you make me feel sick, you make me ashamed to be British. It's exactly that kind of attitude that is responsible the continuation of racist discrimination. Idiot.

Firstly, "cross your legs so you dont say something silly"... ie, youre talking out of your arse. Men have arses too. Nothing sexist there.

Secondly, I am not British. I am not part Scotish, Welsh or Irish, therefore I am English.

Finally, Take a pill and chill out, you started the abuse by calling me a twat. Dont dish it out if you cant take it.

Its do gooders like you who are responsible for the state this country is in. I bet you donate to your local Assylum seekers charity dont you.

Sit down and shut up.

[Mafro]

Do you support the BNP by any chance?

[MK Chris]

Secondly, I am not British. I am not part Scotish, Welsh or Irish, therefore I am English.

If you are English, you are also British. Likewise, if you were Scottish you would also be British.

[Furious]

Ok, so were all European then. Is tha twhat youre saying?

Mafro, do you support labour by any chance or conservative, either way, I dont want to know. Thats your business, the same as who I vote for is my business.

[Mafro]

Calm down dear.

[Furious]

Dear? Are you gay?

[Furious]

Anyway, on a pleasant note, I'm off paintballing for the evening. Lovely weather for it.

See you all soon.

[Mafro]

Dear? Are you gay?

Ha, that's priceless.

[MunroeForbes]

Unfortunately the projected population figures for the UK are declining and the government has to demonstrate economic growth the masses or they will get voted out of power.

The only way the government can sustain economic growth is to bring in immigrants to take the place of the reducing population numbers. This works fine in theory, but unfortunately different cultures do not simply integrate as we all know. There will be tension for a long time to come, no doubt.

As we all know, money comes first for any government. They have to sustain the economy first, and worry about racial integration afterwards.

It's a dilemma. I'd rather accept a lower standard of living and live in a country with a declining population and the financial consequences that entails, but others would prefer the opposite.

The population of the UK do not understand this dilemma and want to keep their standard of living and keep out immigrants. Both cannot be achieved. The solution is for all of us to have more children, but I can't be arsed with that adn neither can the people of the culture we live in.

So if we invite immigrants, we have to make the effort to give them jobs, but not at the expense of people who live here. Everything should be on merit as mentioned several times in this thread before. That is not racist, but 'making our police forces (or any job for that matter) more representative of the citizens they serve' is racist.

[Mafro]

The immigrants are doing the jobs that the sponging gits that are happy to sit on their fat arses with 14 children and live off benefits rather than work, aren't.

[MunroeForbes]

The immigrants are doing the jobs that the sponging gits that are happy to sit on their fat arses with 14 children and live off benefits rather than work, aren't.

Exactly. And they are the type of immigrants we want.

[Mafro]

The funny thing is tha tthe sponging slobs have the cheek to moan about immigrants "stealing all the jobs".

[Sidders]

That is not racist, but 'making our police forces (or any job for that matter) more representative of the citizens they serve' is racist.

How is that racist?

[Lucie]

Its do gooders like you who are responsible for the state this country is in. I bet you donate to your local Assylum seekers charity dont you.

You're clearly incredibly closed minded and stupid then. You're obviously only concerned with preserving your own little comfort zone and not helping anyone else get a better deal.

[MunroeForbes]

Because it means that jobs are being given on something other than merit. I know 2 people that applied to the Metropolitan Police force, one is black and got a date for training within 5 months, the other is white and has been serving as a community support officer for 18 months and has only just been given his training date for October 2006. Senior officers have openly admitted to both of them that they have targets to hit for bringing in minorities and have to push white people to the back of the queue.

Trying to 'balance things out' means that white people are being discriminated against in many establishments. The policy should be to ignore race and give the jobs to the people who are best. If that means we end up with a police force made up predominantly of one race, who cares. It will mean we are better protected.

[fish heads]

Maybe when people like us have had to endure such things slavery and being gassed by the Nazis then we can whine on about what discrimination really is rather than confusing it with inconvinience