[Gaviano]

Did anyone else wince this morning when Chris, who didn't think that Rachel's description of Leona from the X Factor as "the one with the really curly hair" was adequate, went on to describe her as "the half caste"?

I'm not usually overly sensitive to supposed non political correctness, but this term seemed a bit Mind Your Language to me and just one step away from calling her a mulatto, or referring to Robert as "the little coloured fellow".

[Gaspode_The_Wonder_Dog]

I have to admit I was ignorant of the meaning of that phrase until I read this article:

http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Sto ... 19,00.html

I wouldn't feel comfortable saying it now.

[nood]

I think a lot of people use it without realising there are racist connotations, having probably picked it up from someone else who doesn't appreaciate its meaning.

[SAV1OUR]

I'm sure the fact hes in trouble with the pipe-smoking Guardianistas now he'll be bricking it! I've read some of the articles on there and my God do they go on, like its the end of the world, the english language is not to be taken seriously, or not THAT seriously that we read into everything, I dont think.

[Gaspode_The_Wonder_Dog]

Just because they have big words don't be too scared.

Personally I think if it offends someone then I would rather use a term they are comfortable with.

[~bex~]

I think it's really difficult these days to know what words to use. I can understand him wanting to be more specific than the one with the curly hair - Nikitta also has curly hair. It's all very well saying half caste is being racist, but I know people who are half caste and use that term to describe themselves, and would probably be alot more offended to be called mixed race. But then there's the whole mentality some people have that it's OK to use terms like half caste if you personally are half caste, but if you're not it becomes racist. Just sharing my two cents worth.

[SAV1OUR]

If hes going all-out to war on x-factor contestants whoever they may be, not that I invest mental energy on who they are anyway - then maybe we should take it up with the thought police, whatever the name for them is. It was purely a one-off thing for him to say as the show is random anyway. Dont be scared by your own politics and dont let politics get in the way of your life, enjoy the show!

[Gaviano]

Yes, you're quite right. The easiest thing in the world to do is nothing at all. Now, where's me Jim Davidson DVD ...

[SAV1OUR]

Lol you talk about it like you're trying to save the world. Welcome to the forum and everything, but from seeing your lack of posts wouldnt that suggest you have an agenda becase in the past, the left have tried so very hard to paint Moyles as a raging homophobe, and common sense has proved he isnt.

Carry on with your thread by all means, but let me just say, I was listening to that link this morning - the X-factor link, and it really wasn't about demaning contestants, he wasn't slagging any of them off, defending them more like. If I was making a thread about that link, it would be about the ludicrously silly themes the live show has had, and how poor Sideshow Bob was forced to go along with 20th Century musical values, big band, abba etc, I mean, wheres the freedom in that, these starlets are the future, they need originality. ITV ballsed up big time.

Moyles on the other hand, has all these things he likes to talk about, most of them everyday ordinary stuff. But once upon a time boys and girls....The political world and the entertainment world were like 2 different planets, police didnt go sniffing around wasting time on what someone was saying, if it created a laugh, that was good, times were tough. If Chris says something about the Iraq war - which he never does, hes going to be in trouble with the right isnt he? If he goes careless with his tongue he gets in trouble with the left too. I'll leave you to iron out the fine creases of political awareness, none of whats been discussed crossed my mind at all this morning, I was just enjoying the show.

[Gaviano]

I couldn't care less if he gets in trouble with anyone or no one over this or anything else. I just found it a little shocking, that's all and maybe he shouldn't have said it. I don't doubt for a minute that he had no intention of offending anyone. That wasn't my point. You don't care? Fine.

As for an agenda? Seriously, you think? I'm not sure how the number of posts I've made makes my opinion any more or less valid or why you jump to the conclusion that because I'm new I have an agenda. You've made 163 posts in 11 months. I've made 10 in a month. I wouldn't say either of us are particularly prolific. If anything, it probably suggests that we've both got better things to do.

And yes, I enjoy the show otherwise I wouldn't listen to it. Laughed out loud a good few times -- especially at Dave's karaoke.

[SAV1OUR]

OK mate, it was the random bits for me today, like when he burst into geordie accent after hearing girls aloud. Oh and yeah I get offended by what he says about things too, usually petty stuff like when he slags off a telly programme I like etc.

[Boboff]

What makes me laugh is the fact that he called her a half caste then said she had a big nose, and that doesn't get a mention on here, of the two comments the one about a big nose would be more offensive to the girl herself.
What ever you call it the brown skin is very attractive, and boy can she sing !

[Nicola_Red]

I agree that 'half caste' is a bit of an outmoded term and yes that did strike me while I was listening. but only the girl in question can really say whether it was offensive, after all. it's already been pointed out to me regarding another topic on here that it's pointless to be "outraged on behalf of other people"!

[DemonHorse]

I thought the phrase was half-cut? maybe THATS where I've been going wrong all these years...

[MK Chris]

Half-cut refers to someone who is pissed.

[Andy B]

Are we not allowed to say half caste then, I've always said it and no-one's ever told me any different...mind you I do live in an uber white area that's very middle england and one step away from signing up to the BNP (the area, not me) But I used to live in Brixton and no-one said anything there either.

[Yudster]

My two older children are of mixed race. The only time the term "half-caste" has ever been used to them has been in an abusive context. I don't think the term itself was abusive, but over time it seems to have become accepted as abuse. Its not a description I would use, but then I don't tend to describe them as mixed race either - I usually just say they are lucky enough to have dark skin, dark hair and dark blue eyes - their dad was half Indian, hence the genetic possibility for blue eyes. They are incredible looking.

Anyway, I don't think for a minute Chris was being derogatory, he is no more racist than he is homophobic. Won't stop him being criticised, but he will always get criticised one way or the other.

[lazylarry]

Ha that's quality missed the show this morning but will listen later on.

can you not say half cast any more then? Bloody PC brigade next thing they will change the name of manholes to drain outlets and a bin man will become a bin person.

Oh well next time chris just say darkie oh don't tell me your not allowed to say that either OH PERSON what is the world coming to.

[nood]

What I have a problem with is PC brigade trying to changing things like "black boards" to "chalk boards" - for god's sake - the board is BLACK, it's actually the PC brigade who are being racist by picking out that word and associating it with people's skin colour.

[Gaspode_The_Wonder_Dog]

I think you are losing point of the issue. I don't believe anyone is offended by the term blackboard. The point is that the origins of that phrase are abusive and why use the term when someone could be offended by it? I am not criticising Moyles at all because as I said earlier I was ignorant of the phrase but if we all stopped educating ourselves then we would be stuck in an age where explicit racist phrases are accepted.

[nood]

I was commenting re the post previous to mine.

[stevotrash Esq.]

The political world and the entertainment world were like 2 different planets, police didnt go sniffing around wasting time on what someone was saying, if it created a laugh, that was good, times were tough.

Your completely correct, like everyone is on Bin Ladens case but fail to realise he's the greatest tv programme creator since Lew Grade. Back off UN!

Also, it's great to see that Simon Schama has an account on here. I think if you look at past media you'll find many types of political censorship were inforced far vigorously in previous decades/centuries.

Saying that, fingers crossed that the new "Celebrity Black & White Minstrel Show" is a hit?

It's also nice to see Gaspy back, good points as always.

The term is highly offensive as mentioned many times in this thread. Moyles should be aware of this, altough probably is. Moyles is paid a ton of money and when someone is paid a ton of money - whether they like to admit it or not, have some form of responsibility.

Given recent outbursts, it appears like he's trying his hardest to become as "shock jock" as possible. Unfortunently this seems to be going down the Bernard Manning route on some occassions. However, candy coated appearences on Family Fortunes and X Factor are making him look directionless. Have you cake and eat it comes to mind.

[princesslia]

Are we not allowed to say half caste then, I've always said it and no-one's ever told me any different...mind you I do live in an uber white area that's very middle england and one step away from signing up to the BNP (the area, not me) But I used to live in Brixton and no-one said anything there either.

I think at this stage of our lives, and Chris Moyles life, we all know him exactly for what he is, a forthright, entertaining guy, who has built a personality, that has made him become a legend. There comes a time in everyone's life, where a word is said, an imperfection, that can be taken in both directions. We can take this "half-cast" remark in whatever direction we, as indivuduals want to take it. History makes us define or change a word, for what reasons.. mostly, because it takes a public opinion to change these words. As a child I had a Gollywog, a beautiful black curly headed doll, I loved it. I remember my grandmother sending off coupons from our pots of jam, in the late 60's and for so many vouchers collected, I received a Gollywog badge in the post. Now, at that stage in my life and my Grandmother's life this word was used in respect of a popular toy that was sold at that particular time. THAT WORD IS no longer part of my life, simply because of possible insinue of being racist, but at that time of my life was a word used in connection with that particular toy. The word half-caste has been around also, for as long as I can remember, and can remember it being used when I was young. What word describes a person, who has parents of different countries.To me the word half- cast does not hold outrage in any respect.
My father was English my mother was Scottish.. so....That is the same,half caste could easily be used to describe this...I am Scottish I married an English man. Beleive me, my husband took a lot more stick from the Scots, when we lived in Scotland for 21 years remarks that would be classed as much more outrageous than this remark, or word used by Chris. It is only insulting when the word would have been used in abuse of that particular person, in insults, using the word half-caste in verbal abuse, and NOT so in this case. It was a descriptive word, relating to the fact that she had parents of different nationalities. But, public opinion is the way of the world, and we all have different opinions,that is life. So, back to Leona, she should win X Factor, she is the most talented, attractive, person in this show. She has the all round X Factor, and I personally have liked her from day 1, and hopes she wins.

[princesslia]

The political world and the entertainment world were like 2 different planets, police didnt go sniffing around wasting time on what someone was saying, if it created a laugh, that was good, times were tough.

Your completely correct, like everyone is on Bin Ladens case but fail to realise he's the greatest tv programme creator since Lew Grade. Back off UN!

Also, it's great to see that Simon Schama has an account on here. I think if you look at past media you'll find many types of political censorship were inforced far vigorously in previous decades/centuries.

Saying that, fingers crossed that the new "Celebrity Black & White Minstrel Show" is a hit?

It's also nice to see Gaspy back, good points as always.

The term is highly offensive as mentioned many times in this thread. Moyles should be aware of this, altough probably is. Moyles is paid a ton of money and when someone is paid a ton of money - whether they like to admit it or not, have some form of responsibility.

Given recent outbursts, it appears like he's trying his hardest to become as "shock jock" as possible. Unfortunently this seems to be going down the Bernard Manning route on some occassions. However, candy coated appearences on Family Fortunes and X Factor are making him look directionless. Have you cake and eat it comes to mind.

I loooooooooooooved Chris on Celebrity X Factor, thought he had a good voice, and well done to him for entering, it takes a lot of guts to do that, and he knew he would have to take the flak from people.

[Walter Sobchak]

I agree that 'half caste' is a bit of an outmoded term and yes that did strike me while I was listening. but only the girl in question can really say whether it was offensive, after all. it's already been pointed out to me regarding another topic on here that it's pointless to be "outraged on behalf of other people"!

Well Said!

Theres a term, I think its something like inverted racism, this denotes someone being racist by over compensating what may or may not be racist remarks, usually Guardian readers!